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 Post subject: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 6:30 pm 
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I've got a few topics having to do with RP on the server to discuss. Maybe this warrants a RP meeting, but hopefully a forums discussion will be good enough. We'll see.

The issue of distracted RP(whether by a movie, your roommate, or reddit) has always been a problem with the server. If you're not fully engaged with your character, not only are you losing out on enjoying RP, but everybody around you is also suffering by having to RP with a zombie. If you're the only person in the zone, there's nothing wrong with distracting yourself until others arrive, but once other people are RPing on the server we should all be focusing on IC, even if nobody is directly speaking to your character. If they're bored, maybe they should do something IC to alleviate that boredom, rather than sitting there while you entertain yourself with OOC distractions.

I know that unexpected distractions happen to everybody. Don't feel like you have to force yourself to continue RPing if there's something happening that's taken your mind out of it. Excuse your character to the AFK room until it passes, or even log out for the evening. We've all had to do it, and there's no shame in it. Nobody is going to hate you for having to call it a night when you're not mentally engaged, because when you come back to the RP with your head fully in the game it'll be so much more fulfilling, not only for you but for everybody else involved.

It also came to my attention a few days ago that some people were unsure about whether or not they could teach spells to other students. I'm sorry if there was some confusion about it, because the answer is YES! Yes, absolutely, please do this! I'm always happy to ballpark some DCs(general rule: 13/18 for a "sort of" and "successful cast" respectively for a first year spell, +2 to each DC for each year beyond first) and give advice about which subjects to roll.

My rule on how long it takes to learn the spells is that it takes however long the RP requires, but generally one session for spells that aren't NEWT level. Some spells may take two or even three sessions if your character just isn't getting them, but with rare exceptions you shouldn't require days of effort to learn normal spells. NWN spells can be replicated with blank scrolls without involving a DM, while wand spells will require a DM request to have the spell granted. Don't feel like you're bothering us by making this request, you're really not - we want to see people RPing learning spells! Use that wonderful new dueling hall that Necro built!

And finally, the matter of class attendance. Classes on the server have up to this point been OOCly optional to attend. If your character is enrolled in transfiguration but you really would rather RP them eating dinner instead of coming to class, we haven't taken it ICly that you're not there. As the server numbers continue to drop, the server admins have considered the option to make some classes not OOCly optional. That is, if you're online RPing and your character is enrolled in a class that's being taught, but you're doing something else with them, it will ICly be considered a skipped class.

There's several reasons why we've decided to give this a try. First is that we're RPing a school, and classes are a very important part of your character's life here, so it doesn't make sense to avoid attending them. Second is that DMs work hard to prepare interesting classes, and I'll be honest and say it's a little disheartening to look at the players online list and look at who's in the zone and see that there's people skipping out on what you worked so hard on. And lastly is that this will make it more clear to everybody, DM and PC, whether students are ICly skipping class(troublemakers!) or just would rather be doing something else OOCly.

This won't be for every class, especially not spell classes, and we will always give fair OOC warning that RP will have to be wrapped up(or put in a timebubble to continue later). Also, remember that it's always an option to hop on an alt - don't feel like you have to sit by yourself if your character's girlfriend went off to class, just hop on another character and then switch back when class lets out...or not, if you've found more interesting RP!

I'd just like to wrap up by saying that this stuff isn't directed to any one person in particular, most of it is stuff that we all have to work on. I know we all want to help make the server RP environment better, and I think that working on these things will help to accomplish that goal. See you guys in game!

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:20 pm 
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Yendys wrote:
And finally, the matter of class attendance. Classes on the server have up to this point been OOCly optional to attend. If your character is enrolled in transfiguration but you really would rather RP them eating dinner instead of coming to class, we haven't taken it ICly that you're not there. As the server numbers continue to drop, the server admins have considered the option to make some classes not OOCly optional. That is, if you're online RPing and your character is enrolled in a class that's being taught, but you're doing something else with them, it will ICly be considered a skipped class.

There's several reasons why we've decided to give this a try. First is that we're RPing a school, and classes are a very important part of your character's life here, so it doesn't make sense to avoid attending them. Second is that DMs work hard to prepare interesting classes, and I'll be honest and say it's a little disheartening to look at the players online list and look at who's in the zone and see that there's people skipping out on what you worked so hard on. And lastly is that this will make it more clear to everybody, DM and PC, whether students are ICly skipping class(troublemakers!) or just would rather be doing something else OOCly.

This won't be for every class, especially not spell classes, and we will always give fair OOC warning that RP will have to be wrapped up(or put in a time bubble to continue later). Also, remember that it's always an option to hop on an alt - don't feel like you have to sit by yourself if your character's girlfriend went off to class, just hop on another character and then switch back when class lets out...or not, if you've found more interesting RP!

I understand the theories behind the "we aren't going to tell you anything about class unless you're on the server," but I have stronger doubts on its effectiveness when it comes to these required classes. Especially when the DM staff is infamous for only giving 2-3 hours notice on the forum or Facebook (if we're lucky). I understand DMs have lives and some times things are spur of the moment, but players have lives as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:40 pm 
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D_Black wrote:
I understand the theories behind the "we aren't going to tell you anything about class unless you're on the server," but I have stronger doubts on its effectiveness when it comes to these required classes. Especially when the DM staff is infamous for only giving 2-3 hours notice on the forum or Facebook (if we're lucky). I understand DMs have lives and some times things are spur of the moment, but players have lives as well.


You misunderstand. It's only required if you're RPing on the server at that time. The only change is that you're no longer allowed to have your character blow off class and not face IC consequences.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:07 pm 
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And how is this not going to cause anyone and everyone not interested in a Class to just either not log on during those hours, or to log off for the extent of the Class?

There's a difference between people complaining about a lack of DM events, and not attending; and people not complaining about it and doing their own thing.

With a smaller player base, I don't see how this is going to do anything but hurt that.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:11 pm 
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Thank you for clarifying. But what of classes we skip because it's not a part of our character's curriculum. 9/10 I'm skipping certain classes because my character is In his 7th year and no longer has a broad spectrum of classes in his curriculum. The other 1/10 of skipping is because the class is remedial.
Which brings me to my next question, where is the love for year ranges? More often then not, classes are blanketed across years instead of inviting a specific year or a small range of years.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:03 pm 
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D_Black wrote:
Thank you for clarifying. But what of classes we skip because it's not a part of our character's curriculum. 9/10 I'm skipping certain classes because my character is In his 7th year and no longer has a broad spectrum of classes in his curriculum. The other 1/10 of skipping is because the class is remedial.
Which brings me to my next question, where is the love for year ranges? More often then not, classes are blanketed across years instead of inviting a specific year or a small range of years.


Personally, I often find excuses to toss my character into classes they might not otherwise attend, simply because it's more fun to RP that way... I know a lot of other people do this as well, and have for a long time. It's a fun way to change things up.
I would never look for a reason to avoid RP - who knows, if they're ahead of the class your character might get called on to demonstrate or get to utilize their abilities somehow in a new way!

As for year ranges... it's mostly done to ensure everyone logged in can participate, because being left out isn't a great experience. (I believe it's best for us to be shifting towards inclusive play as often as we can.) I ran a somewhat more advanced class the other night because advanced players were who was available at the time.

We simply don't have the population to target specific years, nor do people play enough alts to support that.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:51 pm 
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Necromancer367 wrote:
And how is this not going to cause anyone and everyone not interested in a Class to just either not log on during those hours, or to log off for the extent of the Class?

There's a difference between people complaining about a lack of DM events, and not attending; and people not complaining about it and doing their own thing.

With a smaller player base, I don't see how this is going to do anything but hurt that.

If you'd rather log out than RP, I guess that's a thing you can do? Seems pretty extreme to me. Nobody's going to force Lance to sit through a class teaching Magic Missile, but I'd like to see him and others in the classroom more for RP classes, considering they are students.

D_Black wrote:
Thank you for clarifying. But what of classes we skip because it's not a part of our character's curriculum. 9/10 I'm skipping certain classes because my character is In his 7th year and no longer has a broad spectrum of classes in his curriculum. The other 1/10 of skipping is because the class is remedial.

Yendys wrote:
That is, if you're online RPing and your character is enrolled in a class that's being taught, but you're doing something else with them, it will ICly be considered a skipped class.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 8:59 am 
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You view it as extreme, but others might view it as a simplistic and easy solution to a forceful situation. Why put forth so much effort into a game where you're forced to do things, when you can just log off and play something else or do something else where you don't have to worry about that.

I think you're looking at this from a "How can we get everyone online to RP" standpoint; and I'm trying to look at it from a "How can we get everyone online" standpoint.

In my opinion I foresee a lot more AFKs and Log-Off's, which in turn is only going to create disinterest.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 9:47 am 
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Necromancer367 wrote:
You view it as extreme, but others might view it as a simplistic and easy solution to a forceful situation. Why put forth so much effort into a game where you're forced to do things, when you can just log off and play something else or do something else where you don't have to worry about that.

I think you're looking at this from a "How can we get everyone online to RP" standpoint; and I'm trying to look at it from a "How can we get everyone online" standpoint.

In my opinion I foresee a lot more AFKs and Log-Off's, which in turn is only going to create disinterest.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 1:41 pm 
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Necromancer367 wrote:
In my opinion I foresee a lot more AFKs and Log-Off's, which in turn is only going to create disinterest.


You know, this is a server about a school. We also have post-grad. Pick one. If you are RPing in the school, SOME classes (in particular SOME non-spell classes) will begin to be ICly mandatory. You're not going to be banned for skipping class. But if your character begins to form a record of skipping class, then it's going to start being taken ICly. If school RP causes disinterest, there's a bigger problem here.

Necromancer367 wrote:
I think you're looking at this from a "How can we get everyone online to RP" standpoint; and I'm trying to look at it from a "How can we get everyone online" standpoint.


Yes, the former. I'd take RP quality over numbers any day. I've always said this. As an example of extremes: I'd rather have two people on who are in solid RP than 50 people on who are standing at pillars looking at each other while their players browse Facebook. Ideally, there's a middle ground.

If people want to log out because they don't like the idea of RPing that their character attends a school... I hate to break it to everyone, but this is a school. Your character attends it. It is therefore IC for your character to be there. We have been, and will continue to be -extremely- lenient about allowing characters to RP what you like. Skipping SOME classes will be considered IC. As we've already stated: SOME classes will be ICly/OOCly mandatory, meaning skipping will be taken as IC. This will likely not apply to spell classes, and even then only some of the others. This should not be a shocker that your character is ICly required to go to class, nor should it be a shocker that it is OOCly required that it occasionally be RPd beyond implication. In reality, we're likely talking about at most 1/4 of all classes will fit into this category. If this is so horrible that we lose players and the server dies because people are "forced" into extremely occasional class RP... then like I said before, there are bigger issues here.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 5:59 pm 
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Necromancer367 wrote:
I think you're looking at this from a "How can we get everyone online to RP" standpoint; and I'm trying to look at it from a "How can we get everyone online" standpoint.


I don't want to get off topic or seem rude but I think this is more or less what we should be talking about. I have only been on few days and it seems there are less players on. Maybe it because its the Holidays/school finals just life in general or whatever.....
I just think all this technical and over talked about things about the server needs to stop. I feel like I am being restricted on what I can and can't do anymore. And everything is just sooo serious ALL THE TIME. This is about a bunch of freaking middle school/high school aged kids. Not adults trying to survive a zombie apocalypse. I come on the server to enjoy myself and have fun. I get that there is supposed to be some sort of regulation about RP and everything else...but really come on! None of this was ever a problem. There used to be only like 2-3 DMs, and the server was great. Events were great and people were great. (and there a lot of them on the server now too) This sever used to be fun but its seriously starting to make me lose interest at all. We keep getting into all this technically crap that no one really has ever had a problem with. And maybe I am the only one but I just wanted to get my point across because it has been bugging me. And I don't even know if I got my point fully across but I am sorry for my rant.


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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 6:18 pm 
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ChanceFerrin wrote:
Necromancer367 wrote:
I think you're looking at this from a "How can we get everyone online to RP" standpoint; and I'm trying to look at it from a "How can we get everyone online" standpoint.


I don't want to get off topic or seem rude but I think this is more or less what we should be talking about. I have only been on few days and it seems there are less players on. Maybe it because its the Holidays/school finals just life in general or whatever.....
I just think all this technical and over talked about things about the server needs to stop. I feel like I am being restricted on what I can and can't do anymore. And everything is just sooo serious ALL THE TIME. This is about a bunch of freaking middle school/high school aged kids. Not adults trying to survive a zombie apocalypse. I come on the server to enjoy myself and have fun. I get that there is supposed to be some sort of regulation about RP and everything else...but really come on! None of this was ever a problem. There used to be only like 2-3 DMs, and the server was great. Events were great and people were great. (and there a lot of them on the server now too) This sever used to be fun but its seriously starting to make me lose interest at all. We keep getting into all this technically crap that no one really has ever had a problem with. And maybe I am the only one but I just wanted to get my point across because it has been bugging me. And I don't even know if I got my point fully across but I am sorry for my rant.


No, your point is legit. I agree with you.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 7:37 pm 
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Necromancer367 wrote:
ChanceFerrin wrote:
Necromancer367 wrote:
I think you're looking at this from a "How can we get everyone online to RP" standpoint; and I'm trying to look at it from a "How can we get everyone online" standpoint.


I don't want to get off topic or seem rude but I think this is more or less what we should be talking about. I have only been on few days and it seems there are less players on. Maybe it because its the Holidays/school finals just life in general or whatever.....
I just think all this technical and over talked about things about the server needs to stop. I feel like I am being restricted on what I can and can't do anymore. And everything is just sooo serious ALL THE TIME. This is about a bunch of freaking middle school/high school aged kids. Not adults trying to survive a zombie apocalypse. I come on the server to enjoy myself and have fun. I get that there is supposed to be some sort of regulation about RP and everything else...but really come on! None of this was ever a problem. There used to be only like 2-3 DMs, and the server was great. Events were great and people were great. (and there a lot of them on the server now too) This sever used to be fun but its seriously starting to make me lose interest at all. We keep getting into all this technically crap that no one really has ever had a problem with. And maybe I am the only one but I just wanted to get my point across because it has been bugging me. And I don't even know if I got my point fully across but I am sorry for my rant.


No, your point is legit. I agree with you.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 7:43 pm 
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ChanceFerrin wrote:
I don't want to get off topic or seem rude but I think this is more or less what we should be talking about. I have only been on few days and it seems there are less players on. Maybe it because its the Holidays/school finals just life in general or whatever.....
I just think all this technical and over talked about things about the server needs to stop. I feel like I am being restricted on what I can and can't do anymore. And everything is just sooo serious ALL THE TIME. This is about a bunch of freaking middle school/high school aged kids. Not adults trying to survive a zombie apocalypse. I come on the server to enjoy myself and have fun. I get that there is supposed to be some sort of regulation about RP and everything else...but really come on! None of this was ever a problem. There used to be only like 2-3 DMs, and the server was great. Events were great and people were great. (and there a lot of them on the server now too) This sever used to be fun but its seriously starting to make me lose interest at all. We keep getting into all this technically crap that no one really has ever had a problem with. And maybe I am the only one but I just wanted to get my point across because it has been bugging me. And I don't even know if I got my point fully across but I am sorry for my rant.


Chance, I'm curious. What specifically is technical and serious about the stuff I posted? The outline I wrote that post from has three points:
1. The RPing distracted thing that people have been doing a lot lately? Don't do it. This was a rules reminder, this has always been server rules since long before I started playing. There's nothing new here.
2. You can teach spells to other students. This again is nothing new, and was a reminder because somebody had let me know that some people were unaware that it was an okay thing to do.
3. Head's up, we're going to start doing a thing sometimes where we ask everybody who's online who is enrolled in a class to attend, or ditch ICly. This is pretty much the only new thing in the entire post, and I don't see how this is super serious. As you said, we're RPing middle/high school students.

Also, I feel obligated to point out for #1 and #3, that if it wasn't "ever a problem" it wouldn't have come up for admin discussion. Calan and I don't sit around and brainstorm ways to ruin the server with technical minutea, we watch and go "oh, that thing that's happening there is really messing up RP, I think we should try this thing to see if it makes stuff better" or "I think people forgot about this rule, it's probably time for a reminder."

Xander, can I ask you to please stop posting image macros in this thread? It's a discussion thread, and I'd rather hear your reaction in words rather than an animated picture. It's more constructive.

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 Post subject: Re: Some thoughts on RP
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 8:12 pm 
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Wow, how rude. I give you a reply with words and you delete my post? Its things like this that gives Chance's point(s) a foundation.

-I- deleted your passive-aggressive post. -Calan

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